Victoria's Secret Nurse-in
Categories: Pregnancy & birth, Eating & nutrition
Disclaimer: I'm a guy and I can't help but make "nudge, nudge, wink, wink, say no more" type comments whenever we pass a Victoria's Secret store. It simply blows my mind that someone working at Victoria's Secret -- inventor of the WonderBra! -- would think that a customer might find a woman's breast offensive. I mean, after all, pretty much everyone in there is either planning to show off their breasts or is hoping to see some, right?
Well, on June 21, Rebecca Cook of Quincy, Massachusetts was at a Victoria's Secret when her daughter wanted to nurse. She first tried to use a dressing room, but none were available. She asked to sit out of the way so she could nurse, but was told by an employee that she was not allowed to and would have to use a bathroom. She did eventually get access to a dressing room, but employees stood outside talking loudly about getting customers in and out of the dressing rooms quickly, so she left, still nursing her baby.
When she called to complain to a manager, she was told -- and here is the most incredible part of all this -- that the she had been asked "to nurse in the restroom because the sight of her breasts might offend a customer." Remember, this wasn't the Vatican gift shop, it was Victoria's Secret, inventor of the WonderBra!As if that weren't enough, Jesse Chandler visited another Victoria's Secret store on June 22 intending to feed her daughter and do some shopping. When she asked to use a changing room, she was instead directed to a bathroom outside the store. When she refused to nurse in the bathroom, she was told that "it was unsanitary for her to nurse in the dressing room because people change in them." Unsanitary for the baby? More so than a bathroom? Or for the customers coming in to try on those WonderBras?
Admittedly, when Mrs. Chandler called to complain, the manager apologized. Upon hearing of Mrs. Cook's experience, she called the corporate office and was told that these were isolated incidents and that she would be sent a letter of apology.
These incidents, however, highlighted the need for state and federal protection for nursing mothers. As the press release points out, "The federal government has invested a lot of time and money into advertising about breastfeeding being the best nutrition for babies... ...we have to protect and educate; protect a mother's right to nurse in public, and educate those that work with the public on the proper way to handle nursing in public and those that might complain about it."
With this in mind, the pair are organizing a nurse-in at all Victoria's Secret stores, Saturday, July 1 at 1pm. (Yes, that's tomorrow -- sorry for the late notice, but we just got the tip.) The Nurse-in is not about Victoria's Secret enforcing their policies, but about raising awareness and getting laws on the books to make sure babies can nurse whereever they want. If you're a nursing mother, show up and make a statement that the rights of mothers -- and babies -- need to be protected legally, not just by corporate policy.
Update: Turns out I'm not the expert on women's underwear y'all thought I was. The Wonderbra was not invented by Victoria's Secret, but by a Canadian woman in 1964; it was not introduced to the US until thirty years later.
Well, on June 21, Rebecca Cook of Quincy, Massachusetts was at a Victoria's Secret when her daughter wanted to nurse. She first tried to use a dressing room, but none were available. She asked to sit out of the way so she could nurse, but was told by an employee that she was not allowed to and would have to use a bathroom. She did eventually get access to a dressing room, but employees stood outside talking loudly about getting customers in and out of the dressing rooms quickly, so she left, still nursing her baby.
When she called to complain to a manager, she was told -- and here is the most incredible part of all this -- that the she had been asked "to nurse in the restroom because the sight of her breasts might offend a customer." Remember, this wasn't the Vatican gift shop, it was Victoria's Secret, inventor of the WonderBra!As if that weren't enough, Jesse Chandler visited another Victoria's Secret store on June 22 intending to feed her daughter and do some shopping. When she asked to use a changing room, she was instead directed to a bathroom outside the store. When she refused to nurse in the bathroom, she was told that "it was unsanitary for her to nurse in the dressing room because people change in them." Unsanitary for the baby? More so than a bathroom? Or for the customers coming in to try on those WonderBras?
Admittedly, when Mrs. Chandler called to complain, the manager apologized. Upon hearing of Mrs. Cook's experience, she called the corporate office and was told that these were isolated incidents and that she would be sent a letter of apology.
These incidents, however, highlighted the need for state and federal protection for nursing mothers. As the press release points out, "The federal government has invested a lot of time and money into advertising about breastfeeding being the best nutrition for babies... ...we have to protect and educate; protect a mother's right to nurse in public, and educate those that work with the public on the proper way to handle nursing in public and those that might complain about it."
With this in mind, the pair are organizing a nurse-in at all Victoria's Secret stores, Saturday, July 1 at 1pm. (Yes, that's tomorrow -- sorry for the late notice, but we just got the tip.) The Nurse-in is not about Victoria's Secret enforcing their policies, but about raising awareness and getting laws on the books to make sure babies can nurse whereever they want. If you're a nursing mother, show up and make a statement that the rights of mothers -- and babies -- need to be protected legally, not just by corporate policy.
Update: Turns out I'm not the expert on women's underwear y'all thought I was. The Wonderbra was not invented by Victoria's Secret, but by a Canadian woman in 1964; it was not introduced to the US until thirty years later.
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Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
P's Mama 6-30-2006 @ 3:07PM
Where do these women live? I've read so many stories of women who were asked not to breast-feed so as not to offend anyone and just can't imagine how I've never come across this myself. I breastfed my daughter everywhere - stores, parks, restaurants - and never, ever heard as much as a snicker. I guess I should consider myself one of the lucky ones.
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SpecialRed21 6-30-2006 @ 3:38PM
So, let me get this straight: Employees of VS, who regularly see the breasts of customers during professional fittings or the try-on process, were offended by seeing a breast?
I don't get it. I might grasp the concept if this were a very conservative store, but for cripes sake, its VS.
This country really needs to get the hell over this prudish behavior. Every other country in the world doesn't regard nudity, breastfeeding, or any other natural thing as "dirty", "unsanitary" or "vulgar". Seriously, folks, they're boobs. Lumps of fat hanging off a chest, intended to nourish infants. Every female has em. So what's the big hubbub all about? I see boobs every damn day of my life, I'm certainly not about to get offended by seeing someone else's doing as nature intended.
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LS 6-30-2006 @ 3:41PM
I know I'm probably going to get piffed for this, but... VS is a business. They provide those dressing rooms for paying customers. Why couldn't this mom go and sit somewhere else and feed? Every mall I've ever been in has a "quiet spot" somewhere in it, with benches or chairs, and often, fountains and greenery. And it's not like the baby being hungry was a big surprise - I always planned my day around my son's feeding schedule for exactly this reason - I didn't want to have to worry about where to go.
I'm not saying that the behavior of the employees is right - they gave her permission, and should have left her alone. But to simply expect you should be able to breast-feed anytime, anywhere - regardless of what the law says - is ridiculous.
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thordora 6-30-2006 @ 3:48PM
I don't know LS, I eat pretty much anywhere I want, and see many people doing the same in stores, even with "NO EATING" signs. Why? Stores let me do this because they WANT my business.
I don't get the impression either woman was walking by VS and said "Gee, let's have a nibble shall we?"-it seems more like they were shopping anyway, and politely requested to use facilities out of the way.
As customers we usually demand pretty much everything else in order to shop in a store-i don't believe allowing the odd breastfeeding mother to use the dressing room for a little while is going to bring capitalism down. And at the end of the day, as usual, talk with your wallets folks.
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Rachel Mosteller 6-30-2006 @ 4:14PM
Uncle Roger: Please know that we only use one type of breastfeeding picture here. Everyone seriously enjoys that one picture and they'd like to see it more.
Also, boobies for everyone!!!
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cathmum 6-30-2006 @ 4:29PM
The first time I breastfed my infant son in a mall (who is now 7) was at the Lloyd Centre Victoria's Secret in Portland, OR. I sat on their comfy, over-stuffed chairs outside the fitting room(very comfortable) and nursed my baby while my friends tried on bras in the fitting rooms. It is one of my favourite memories and I have told many people that it was fitting that I nursed the baby for the first time in public, in a bra store. And I don't even shop there, but everytime I walk by VS, I don't think of bras, I think of my nursing experience.
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Melissa 6-30-2006 @ 4:37PM
I think nurse in's are pretty dumb to beging with. If people are put off by nursing, a nurse in isn't going to help the cause. What it will do is prove that the breastfeeding nazi's are at it again and people will roll their eyes and walk away. I know I do when ever I hear about one.
VS are in malls people. There are benches right out side of the store most of the time. And at least nearby. It's not like she had no other option. This isn't going to make the issue more "equal", it's going to make breastfeeders look like they are on the short bus to special favors. "look at me, I"m breastfeeding, give me special attention". Get over ourselfes already.
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Missy 6-30-2006 @ 4:46PM
Two points:
1) Why was she in a VS anyway? They don't have nursing bras and their largest size is, if I remember correctly, something like 42DD. Anyone with a larger cup size (pretty much any nursing mom who was a large B to small C prepregnancy or higher will be on the big end of DD or higher while nursing) won't have much luck there.
2) I hope, in their apology letters, VS included a coupon for a free thong.
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Ginny 6-30-2006 @ 4:52PM
Too funny Rachel. I hadn't even noticed it was a different one. If had been the SAME one, I would have. lol Yeah Roger, get with the program. lol JK
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SpecialRed21 6-30-2006 @ 4:55PM
Is it at all possible that she was buying *gasp* britches?
Seriously, ladies, we all consider ourselves some open-minded, free-thinking individuals here, so let's do the math.
It IS possible that a nursing mother would choose *gasp* to NOT wear a nursing bra, but rather a REGULAR bra. I know many who have done so. Or is that, now, going to become taboo?
And, it IS possible that she was buying *gasp* underwear for herself, expecially considering the woman just had a child. Things don't quite fit the way they used to, and it's often neccessary to re-up on the panty department.
Let's remember one key element here: Just because someone here personally wouldn't breastfeed, or wouldn't breastfeed in the store, or would rather wear a regular bra vs. a nursing bra... IN NO WAY IMPLIES THAT EVERY OTHER MOTHER SHOULD FOLLOW SUIT.
I come to these blogs to appreciate the open-mindedness, the "live and let live" philosophies, and to see what worked for other mothers, and time and time again I see one mother stating that because SHE personally wouldn't choose one thing, that every other mother should do the same. Let's start to embrace PERSONAL CHOICE, ladies, not to mention MIND YOUR OWN BUSINESS: If you don't want to see a nursing mother, you most certainly can turn your head the other way.
*BTW - this comes from a mother who chose NOT to breastfeed, and if I did, I would not have publicly nursed, but I WILL support any other mother's rights to do so.
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suburban misfit 6-30-2006 @ 5:07PM
Missy: Not necessarily. I was a large B before pregnancy and while nursing I was a small D. And I could pump 8 oz. in seconds, so it's not like my supply was weak.
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momma2mingbu 6-30-2006 @ 5:15PM
LS - It's not like she went into VS with the sole purpose to feed her baby. She was there shopping and THEN her baby needed to nurse. She *was* a potential customer. (Although, with how she was treated, I wonder if she bought anything afterwards?)
AND...I have to ask why would she feel she needed to hide in the dressing room to nurse? Maybe she just needed to go somewhere private to latch on and then she'd have been OK? Every VS I've ever been in has some chairs in or near the dressing room. Surely she could have used one of those. Where they really *THAT* busy that they couldn't have spared *ONE* dressing room for a short while?
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Eden 6-30-2006 @ 5:18PM
Slightly OT but I have used regular bras as nursing bras. A demi-cup works fine and it's hard to find larger sized bras w/ decent support. I'd take an underwire demi over a no-support nursing bra (which costs twice as much) any day.
But there had to be a more comfortable dressing room to nurse in than one at VS. I've found them small and tacky. Usually ladies rooms (or family restrooms) in larger, upscale department stores have sofas, etc. for breastfeeding moms to use and are far less frequented and more private than a dressing room.
I boycott VS anyway. They sell my size out of a cardboard box shoved under a table that I have to dig through instead of in a drawer or on a hanger. ;)
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Missy 6-30-2006 @ 5:33PM
I didn't mean that all nursing moms wear nursing bras. The fact remains that VS doesn't carry nursing bras (most bra stores don't...WTF?).
I sure do because my boobs just got way too big, and lugging them in and out of a regular bra causes painful wear and tear on them. I'm now down to one nursing a day (my son is 19 months old) and my boobs only now fit back into my old C cups (I was up to a large DD and no, I can't pump very easily).
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Amanda (Officially A Mom) 6-30-2006 @ 5:34PM
I totally got robbed. I have been nursing for a year and my medium B's have turned into large A's. I have to be the only person whose breasts become SMALLER when they lactate.
I'm not a nurse-in kind of gal but more power to the mommas who choose participate.
Say it with me now:
2
4
6
8
We deserve to lactate!
(that's my nurse in protest chant in case you were wondering)
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clara 6-30-2006 @ 6:31PM
Her first mistake was asking permission. You just sit down & nurse wherever you want, I would not going into a dressing room personally b/c it would be boring. There`s better people watching in the mall. People should not be intimidated, women have the right to nurse in public anywhere in the US. Most of the time, if you just pull your shirt down to the top of your babies head, nobody even knows you`re nursing, the big shawls scream out IM NURSING!
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clara 6-30-2006 @ 6:33PM
One more thing, I`ve actually nursed in the Vatican gift shop in Rome & that`s the best place to nurse in public, b/c nobody loves babies like the Catholic Church. :)
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Diana Keller 6-30-2006 @ 9:25PM
I always liked privacy when I nursed too. When I'm nursing I get so HUGE, I can't nurse in my sling because my boobies hang down to my knees, I'm 5'1", but wear a G when nursing, so I'm not really able to be very discreet. In my earlier life, I ran a busy dress shop and would always let my customers use a fitting room to nurse, but in the summer or on a weekend we were too busy to do this, to tie up a dressing room for 15 minutes to half and hour would mean I had a HUGE line of ladies waiting for that room, so instead I would offer whatever other chair was avaliable. Sometimes it's not always that the employee/business doesn't want to be helpful, but they are in the business of selling clothing, not just a cosy spot to nurse.
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Kelly 6-30-2006 @ 9:37PM
1.) I am not willing to give carte blanche truthiness to these two women. Seems to me that they could well be exagerating the response they received.
2.) Nor do I doubt that they might have met resistance by the VS employees. Every employer that caters to women ought to educate their workforce better about their policies.
3.) VS has been in the news for similar incidents over the past year, which leads me to believe that VS and Limited Brands really need to focus on #2 and that lactivists out there itchin for a fight have an easy target, ergo #1.
4.) Nurse ins and NIP are important and valuable -- people need to see nursing mothers. Nursing will never be seen as the status quo for infant feeding until it comes out of the closet . . . er . . . fitting room.
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cori w 6-30-2006 @ 10:39PM
FYI - just a quick note of correction, VS did NOT invent the WonderBra. WonderBra is it's own brand carried at many stores. VS does not carry the WonderBra, they carry only their own store-brand bras.
i am currently breastfeeding though and it would be awesome to go do the nurse-in...
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