Time out in the car

Nolan's what, two and a half?

Have the non-driver look back and say, very firmly, something along the lines of "Nolan. We are talking to each other. When we are done, we will be glad to talk to you. You need to be patient. We *will not* speak to you as long as you are behaving rudely, and you *will* get a time-out as soon as it is safe to stop if you keep this up." If the non-driver isn't you, you should chime in at this point with something like "Listen to Grandma" or something.

And mean it. Next time he speaks up rudely (and that was rude!), say "What did we say?" and if it's a third time, yes, find a safe place to exit and pull over and give him a time-out.

If you're not going to be able to give him a time-out, leave that part out entirely, just continue to ignore him totally after the first "We're not talking to you while you're behaving so rudely" comment. Obviously, never make a threat you are not totally prepared to follow through on. Ever. (The same thing goes for promises. If you promise to do something, only hell, high water, or herds of wild horses ought to stop you.)

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I am eagerly going to check these comments, as my 2yo is doing the same thing right now. Her expression is *DOP IT GUYS!* (stop it guys). She'll tell my husband and I to *dop it* whenever she wants attention and in the car is the hardest. So far we have gently told her that she is being rude and that we will talk to her when we are finished. I agree that its the follow through that is most important, and toughest to do.

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seriously you need Super Nanny.
Your kid is the one I use to teach my daughter how NOT to behave in public. So I guess I owe you a huge thanks for your lack of parenting skills.
I hope you seriously appreciate your nanny AND your mom for putting up with the monster you have created. And being a single parent has nothing to do with it. Nor does the "boys will be boys" excuse. My mom raised my sister and I alone. we never behaved like Nolan does. It wasnt tolerated in any way. We were never spanked though. we just were raised better. And I have met quite a few single moms of boys that are your sons age that are not any where near the hellion yours is.

Never mind goat trauma making a person a social deviant. Try parenting trauma or lack of parenting skills making one a deviant. Or a general monster.

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Uly, what exactly is a "time out" when noplace is safe for your child other than with you? If all it does is inconvenience you, and not really punish the child (and lengthen the trip so he is more tired, hungry, and cranky), then it will hurt more than help.

I would do a few things:

1) Tell him that it's rude, that he must stop, and that you and Grandma don't want to talk to someone who is rude. The next time it happens, say you are not going to talk to him for __ minutes and really stick to it, no matter how much he screams.

2) If this continues, warn him that with the next infraction, he's going to lose the chance to do his fun stuff at the mall (whatever that happens to be), and really stick to it. He is old enough to have sufficient attention span to think well ahead and remember his past behavior.

3) If obnoxious behavior continues, make him stay in the car with Grandma while you go do an errand (or with you while Grandma does).

4) Warn him that if he can't behave when you go out, he won't get to go with you next time. Then follow through (using Grandma or a paid babysitter to stay with him while you get stuff done). Let him know that you're doing this because you only want to take well-behaved children out in public, and based on your recent experience, he doesn't meet that description. Then at a later date, try going out again but remind him in advance of the behavior you expect while he has the privilege of going out with you - and the consequences if he acts up.

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OK, M4M, I am wondering what Kristen did to you to make you want to attack her so harshly all the time.

Your child is by no means perfect, and you certainly are nowhere close. Oh the temptation I felt after reading your post under the entry about "we don't pick on other parents when it comes to potty training." I managed to restrain myself, but really, you need a taste of your own medicine.

You should remember that you do not see all of Nolan's life, only the snapshots that Kristen chooses to put on the internet to ask for advice. Obviously these are going to be his most difficult moments. For all you know, he is an angel 99.5% of the time. But wouldn't it be boring if Kristen's daily post went on and on about how good Nolan was today? And how would that be helpful to readers? It would just make other moms who struggle feel bad - which apparently is quite OK as far as you are concerned.

I think your own parents' parenting style is suspect given that you obviously never grew up. But, I should not pick on people who are not even part of the conversation.

Or perhaps this is your preferred way of stirring up shit because your life is otherwise too boring. I think the least you could do is spread your meanness around to all the posters.

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First of all...you go SKL :D...
now, back to the subject...Oh man, I feel your pain. My daughter seems to always want to act up in the car because its like she knows that I'm trapped! one time she was making some ridiculous request and I told her no, she then proceeded to kick the back of my seat in anger. for about a nanosecond I considered ignoring it, then I decided NO, I'm not letting that go.
I pulled the car over and got out, opened the back door got in her face and told her that I WILL NOT TOLERATE her kicking my seat and 'IF YOU DO THAT AGAIN I WILL SPANK YOUR BUTT'. needless to say she never did it again. However, fastforward a year and now she just acts up and yells and is constantly asking me to pick up whatever toy she dropped and whines when I tell her I can't. so far, what I've been doing is, I turn off the music, try to reason with her, then I try ignoring her, then sometimes I turn the music up so I can't hear her whining. (that's probably not the best way but it works for me) I ususally don't have people traveling with me but when I do, I warn them that she needs about 3-4 minutes of your attention first because she is excited that someone besides her grumpy momma is in the car too, after the initial excitement wears off then I can usually reason with her. because she does listen well to other people. (why is that?!)

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Oh, My Gosh!!! M4Mommy or M for MONSTER???

What the heck are you thinking???
MY girls are VERY well-behaved children (I have 3: ages 14, 10 & 3), but I would be remiss to say that ALL of them didn't go through similar stages!
Either you have a vendetta with Kristin or you are lying through your teeth.
It is actually very normal for INTELLIGENT children to test the limits; that is how they learn.
On another note: I would NOT want your Karma after a hateful comment like you wrote. If I said something so cruel to another mom, I guarantee you, MY OWN children would be the brats from hades for the next week. LOL
Seriously, have you no empathy whatsoever?

I am probably a stricter disciplinarian than even you (judging from your comments), but I have NEVER told another mother that they are doing a lousy job. You are obviously very young and very ignorant.
Talk to me again when you have a teenager.

Kristin,
I read your contributions faithfully and I think you are doing a wonderful job! This is typical 2-3 year old behavior and I think the suggestions above are excellent. I totally agree with staying consistent and following through on whatever you promise/threaten. When you don't, they don't learn a thing.
You are a great mom! Nolan is VERY LUCKY to have you.

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First off -- Amanda, Summer, Uly, Meagan Emily -- thank you for your sweet and useful comments.

Anji -- Thank you for saying what I cannot. :-)

SKL -- Thanks for your well-written defence.

And M4Mommy, thank you for strengthening my resolve to be a better Mother, a less judgmental person. Yes, my son is flawed and so is my parenting. But the key is that we're both improving and in the meantime, I have a very sweet little boy: one who kisses my hurt arm, offers to share his prized little cars, bubbles with spontaneous love and hilarious observations on a daily basis. You can slag me all you want, but calling my son a Monster based on the tiny snippets of his personality that I let you see, is seriously, utterly crappy.

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I agree with the approach suggested by SKL. If he acts up, and does not pay attention to warnings, he doesn't get to go into the mall/store etc. Obviously, you need a person willing to stay in the car with Nolan or do your shopping for you. I'd try this approach several times and see if you get results. You could do something similar when he acts up in the store. Have someone go with you, and as soon as he ignores a warning from you have them take him back to the car.

Or, do all your shopping without him while he is with his grandparents or nanny. Easier on you for sure, but Nolan won't learn the consequences from his actions.

I think you recommended reading the 'Love & Logic' books some time ago, but it might be time to re-read them. That's what I'm currently doing! Also, I like the Supernanny books, and have found that many of her suggestions work with my 2 1/2 year old. Anything to help me make it through the terrible twos is a good thing!

Unlike M4Mommy, I'm not a perfect parent of a perfect child! How lucky for her to be so much better than the rest of us!

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You could, if it gets really bad, pull into a safe location (parking lot, gas station), and get out of the car, leaving him in his car seat, and STAY RIGHT THERE but outside the car. For maybe five minutes. Long enough for him to realize you are serious. At this age, I doubt the "You'll get punished later" will be effective because he cannot relate the punishment later to what he did then.

When my 2 year old gets like this in a store, if she's in a shopping cart, I make sure she's safely secured, then I move to the front of the cart and pull it. It's kind of a mini time out; she gets no attention for her behavior, and she generally comes around within a couple of minutes. I think the key is to stay calm and collected yourself, and be consistent and fair. Once you start yelling you've lost it.

Good luck, mom of a completely normal toddler. =)

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