New York Kids in Foster Care Too Long, Report Shows

The system also fails many would-be adoptive parents.

That said, nobody has a right to judge another for the way they choose to build their family, assuming laws are followed.

If you feel strongly about adopting from the foster care system, by all means, do so, and give support to others who are like-minded.

As a matter of fact, SKL, I do plan to adopt, always have, and I would like to be a foster parent as well, as soon as I am established enough so that any money I receive for fostering a child would go to a bank account for that child to be used when they are out of foster care.

That being said, if you ask people who use invitro for their reasons, it's never "I want to pass on my genes" it's "I want to be a parent." You can be a parent to a child without having given birth to it, and I'm sorry, but in my opinion, it's selfish to pick invitro over adoption. I'm sure there are many people whose opinions differ, but that is mine.

There are multiple reasons why different people choose conception technology over adoption. One of them is the cost. I don't know where you read about "millions of dollars" (unless you mean in the aggregate), but in vitro doesn't cost as much as most adoptions do. There are also many risks in adoption and many emotions at play. Bottom line, it isn't for everyone (not that parenting, is for that matter). You're certainly entitled to your opinion, but I hope it is a very informed one before you call a large number of everyday people "selfish."

SKL, last time I checked the cost of one round of invitro fertilization is $10,000 or more. The cost to adopt (and I mean here in America, not in an agency specializing in white babies) is $3000 or less, more if you want a specific child, or a child from another country. So for the price of three adopted children people have one child (or six unhealthy ones if they don't use selective reducing). Not to mention that the cost is less if people adopt older children, because being in foster care past the age of seven is usually an indication that someone is in foster care for the rest of their childhood. How is this not selfish? And how many people just go through invitro once? It is usually a multi-round process if the first one doesn't take, or if people want to have more children. That is another ten grand. Now, if someone is saying I want my children to have my genes because I am successful and I feel passing on my genetic material is beneficial to mankind, well that is one thing (although, odds are if your genes are truly superior, you would have no trouble conceiving). I can respect that. But if you are saying I would only be a parent to someone with my genetic material, well, I think that is very selfish. For people who truly love and want to nurture children, it goes beyond the biological. To say you would only love a child of your loins--how is that not selfish on your part? Look at Nadya Shulman (Octomom). Can you truly say she is an unselfish person?

I'm not saying that everyone who can't have children should adopt, but I think more people should undertake that option before invitro.

Well, Elizabeth, I'm sure your research was very comprehensive but it doesn't sound that way. Maybe it's just your writing style, but it sounds to me like you are judging from your gut, not a depth of knowledge. You say you want to adopt. That is wonderful. When you undertake this (as I'm sure you won't change your mind when it's time to actually put actions behind your words), you will certainly do a lot more research about the costs and risks of the various options, and also, by that time, you will probably know more people who have tried other ways to build their families. So maybe you will develop a bit of compassion. For example, maybe you will realize that the people you speak of so insensitively may have had numerous miscarriages, each of which is a lost child to them. Would you speak the same way of a couple who had five kids killed in a car accident and then decided to try to have another? Maybe you would, but I hope not. It's pretty clear you are not trying to put yourself in the shoes of people actually faced with such decisions. It's easy to say "I would." I will give you more respect after you can say "I did."

SKL, I can only speak to my experiences. As someone who was in a foster situation and currently works with foster children, I can tell you that a lot of us feel this incredible feeling of rejection when you hear about people who would rather have their own unhealthy baby than adopt a healthy you. There is this feeling of not being good enough among foster kids--first you weren't good enough for your parents, then this foster family, now these adoptive parents. When I hear about people who have gone through several rounds of in vitro fertilization, spending tens of thousands of dollars for ONE child, I cannot tell you how upsetting that is when you have to look at an 8 year old's face who knows in her heart she is too old to be adopted. I'm sorry if you feel I am unsympathetic to those who have had miscarriages, I know from my mother's experience it is terrible, but I perhaps I would feel more apathy if more people would answer this question: why do you feel you need to have a baby of your own? Now, I don't ask this in a mean or condescending manner, but I am truly curious. Why is your desire to pass on your genes so strong? It's true, the need to breed and preserve the species is something innate within us. But why, when we know there are so many needy children, would you spend that money not knowing for sure if you will conceive or not? I am curious to know the answer. Obviously, if you have the money to have in vitro, you have the money to adopt a child. Why is in vitro so much more attractive an option?

Elizabeth, that's the thing - as you say, you don't know, you don't understand from the prospective parent's perspective. So why do you think you are in a position to judge?

The only person you can control is yourself. If you're cut out to adopt from the foster care system, like I said, by all means, adopt; adopt several, adopt a dozen if that's where your heart is. There are many like you. Some have successful adoptions, some failed ones, some a mixture of the two. LIke I also said before, support those who are moved to do this but may not have all the resources to make it a success, whether in the form of finances, respite, advocacy, mentoring, etc., which I'm sure you're familiar with if you work in this field. There isn't a need for every prospective parent to adopt from foster care. A lot of ground can be covered by just supporting those who are already working to make things better.

And the reality is, some kids are not better off in a family setting. So the government needs to understand that too. Unfortunately, they try to place these kids in homes, and this is what makes the idea of adoption from foster care scary for many. All it does is hurt kids who could have had a chance at a real family.

SKL, I wasn't implying that every prospective parent adopt from the foster system. There are a million adoption agencies out there, however, most specialize in babies. What I do want to know, and what you still haven't answered, is why a parent would choose in vitro over adoption, why some people feel they need a physical tie to their child rather than emotional? What would someone who chooses in vitro say to a child that needs and wants to be adopted as their reason for choosing in vitro, something that is not 100% guaranteed to result in a child. Now it's true, adoption can be a lengthy process, if you are very particular about it (and I don't mean to say about the child you get, I mean in terms of physical characteristics and age, ie, it is much quicker to adopt a 7 year old than a baby). But with adoption, you are guaranteed a child. Yes, it's not going to be an easy transition, but what is easy about parenting?

As for writing from my gut, you bet your ass I do. I feel deeply for these kids and very strongly about adoption, too. My research into in vitro is more scientific than anything else. In your opinion I am ill informed on the subject, so please, enlighten me. From your writing style, it sounds as if you have a depth of knowledge, so please, do share it so that I can be a good judge like you.

Elizabeth, I have no desire to judge your choices as far as your own family goes, nor anyone else's. But I know enough about people to know that the desire to bear a child, or to have a biological connection to one's child, is not easily written off as selfishness. Sometimes there is ignorance at play, but not always.

Some things are complex. This is one of them. There is no "one" reason, nor even a dozen reasons, why people make the choice to pursue all the available avenues toward procreation before (or instead of) considering adoption. But whatever an individual's reason, it's best that they acknowledge their feelings as opposed to going down a path that they are guilted into.

When I hear someone say "I couldn't love another child" (which is only one of many "reasons" I've heard), I think, well, I'm sorry about that, but I wouldn't want that person to adopt.

Some people might have all the charitable feelings toward these foster kids, but they recognize they are not up to the job of parenting them. It's one thing to parent an infant, quite another to parent a child who comes with a lot of baggage. Again, I'd rather someone recognized their limitations before jumping in and trying to apply an entirely wrong set of principles in nurturing a fragile young person. As a sub-set of that, there are folks who don't feel up to the task of parenting a child of a different race or culture - not because they are racist, but because they can't personally relate to the challenges these kids will face in order to help them address such challenges.

Then, as you mentioned, there are primal urges that impact individuals / couples in different ways. Who am I to demand an accounting of the whys and wherefores of a person's most heartfelt desires?

That foster kid you are talking about who knows some adults don't "want" him - do you really think he wouldn't figure it out if someone adopted him but didn't wholeheartedly desire him as their son? You can't prescribe familial love and acceptance. It has to come from the heart. It's not going to happen for some people - just like finding the perfect mate. That's reality. But at least the government could try to break down the unnecessary barriers that frustrate even the "meant to be" adoptions.

SKL, I understand and agree with most of what you have said in that last bit, and indeed, I would not someone who wouldn't truly be compatible with a child to take one. However, that is a rare occurrence, and generally we find that this doesn't happen so much with older children as with toddlers. As you may know, a lot of the regulations and "barriers" are designed and in place to ensure that we are not placing a child with someone who would molest or harm them in any way. They are also in place so that the family the child is placed with will take care of the child's needs both financially and emotionally. The good thing about the foster system is that prospective parents have sort of a "trial basis" with their children to see if they are compatible, which isn't something the private adoption agencies have. The reason these rules and regulations you complained of are in place specifically so that someone who didn't wholeheartedly desire this child would end up with him. It seems that in our society people tend to focus on the negatives of adoption (unless of course they are also mentioning abortion in the same breath) and forget the negatives of in vitro fertilization. We hear about how someone waited for three years and then were denied a child, or someone who had tried for years to conceive and now has triplets. There are pros and cons to both, and yes, people must consider both sides when choosing a family. But I would suggest people at least volunteer to work with foster kids at a group house before making the final decision. Foster kids tend to get a bad reputation, but really they got a raw deal. They're in a messed up system that has very little sympathizers, and most of them just want a home of their own and a family of their own.